Re: Do LGATs restrict access to water? Dehydration decognition

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I can see that posts that expose the lies of the moderators are suppressed. And even after Corboy admitted his error he continued lying about a day later!
Good move to remove the thread to cover up the lie. Who's the one brainwashing people here?

and of course I see that Rick Ross has an extensive criminal record. Felonies I believe. And lawsuits.

No integtrity here. Liars. Charlatans. Criminals.

But we are watching you.

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Manipulating the room's environment
Posted by: Hope
Date: May 14, 2004 03:43AM

What's interesting is how DPA brought up a minor error on Corboy's post, yet did not reply to my post on the lack of integrity between the schedule info on LEC's web page and the actual schedule in the Forum. Participants were really pissed off, but by the time we realized we would not be leaving anywhere near midnight, we knew it was futile to protest.

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Manipulating the room's environment
Posted by: Ginge
Date: June 20, 2004 02:23AM

This site is fascinating - thanks for all the LEC stuff. It has helped me assess my own LM experiences, but questions still remain.

Having recently done the LE Forum and Advanced courses (FOOL!!), I came away after both with cold/flu like symptoms. The advanced course was 5 weeks ago and I am still coughing sporadically. On analysis, I place the blame of these illnesses on the sealed-environment and re-circulating of stale air mode of operation of the air conditioning. As a result of having to take time off work to recover from both illnesses, there is no way that I intend going near the LEC training rooms again.

At the beginning of one of the first-day sessions of the Forum, I quizzed a "helper" about the air con as the air tasted vile. After 45 minutes of running, the air con had not removed the "stale breath" taste and the feeling was one of reduced oxygen; breathing required noticably more effort to keep from feeling drained or light headed. My concern was brushed off with a flippant "no one else has complained", or some similar message. I countered by questioning if the air con was a sealed system merely processing the air in the room, or whether it exhausted stale air to the outside world and brought in new air. "It is set the way it is set for all courses". Not a particularly helpful response.

Once I had accepted that (in Landmarkian) "the air con is the way it is because it is the way it is", or in the world of reality, I realised I was not going to get a sensible answer unless I spoke to the air con equipment supplier, I took note of how it was adjusted throughout the sessions: hot, cold, on, off. The variations were noticably different to the point of needing to put on / take off a sweater. In a sealed-environment with re-circulating stale air, a prime breeding-ground for cold/flu. (At one point I even considered the possibility of the air con being a breeding ground for the Legionella bug).

The Advanced course was held in a smaller training room (equally as sparse as the Forum; same decor, same intimate chair spacing, same useless air con, but thankfully a much smaller group). I raised the same air-con questions, and got a very similar answer from a different helper. A programmed response, I guess.

Getting off the subject line a bit, right from the beginning of the Forum, I had suspicions of mind-games. Hopefully the suspicions and the suspect air-con helped in not allowing me to be totally sucked in (er, well, I did carry on to the Advanced). In 3 days I felt that I did not "get it", and frankly, at the time I was annoyed that I seemed to get nothing, but some folk appeared to have had major "breakthroughs", although the gut-spilling process was embarrassingly vile. Gut-spilling in public is not part of my make-up.

The Forum fear exercise did absolutely nothing for me. The leader guided the group deeper into fear and all I could think was that his lines breached the bounds of sensibility, and therefore credibility, and my reaction was to reject it as a load of rubbish. All credibility was lost when the "empty and meaningless" bit came up. "Yeah, just like this course!".

Anyway, I want on to the Advanced course to see if I would "get it". Well, I got a debilitating dose of cold/flu, a heavy mind***k, lighter wallet, and little else. I must have been dozing in the Forum sessions that covered rackets and stories, because I still cannot remember their definitions, and felt a bit left-out in the Advanced when rackets were again discussed.

With regard to the sleep deprivation, yes, I did notice that it was a major factor, but refused to bow to the pressure - when my body signals the need for sleep I acknowledge the need and I sleep.... and to hell with the circumstances. As for making midnight or 8 am telephone calls at weekends, NO WAY. I place a higher value on keeping the good relationships that I have.

The exercise that I found most disturbing in the advanced course was the one where the participants stand toe-to-toe and look into each other's eyes for an extended period of time. Not comfortable or natural. After that I felt totally drained; emotionally, psychologically and physically. For the rest of the day I was totally out of it - a mere observer on the course and in no-way a participant.

Towards the end of the Advanced course each participant has to state what they have "created" for themselves. Some statements were so far fetched as to be totally unbelievable. Surely a mere statement of intent is insufficient to change a person's life? It may sow the seeds of some ideas, but the effort (in time and money) that would be required by some people to see the ideas through were bordering on super-human. Surely, as the ideas become unachievable, these people would feel deep failure? Presumably leading them to go back to LM for more courses?

What is the purpose of the notes that the helpers at the back of the room seem to be constantly taking? What are the notes themselves? Why are notes constantly being taken?

Is it possible to
1. Assess one's state of immunity to the Landmark programming?
2. Assess how deeply the Landmark programming has affected a person?
My wife says I have not changed, a friend who has done the Forum says I am more approachable, am not as moody, and more in touch with my emotions.
Personally, after having had no Landmark contact (apart from a few diplomatically terminated phone calls) I feel no different as a person, but do feel conned. Is this normal/reasonable/good?

Thoughts and feedback welcome.

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Manipulating the room's environment
Posted by: hossgal
Date: June 22, 2004 08:41AM

Ginge,

Your reaction to Landmark is quite similar to mine. After the inital euphoria wore off, I was the same person, though the feeling I'd been hoodwinked grew and persisted. However, if that's the worst thing that happened to you (feeling conned), consider yourself lucky! Many of the folks who write in here have suffered the loss of jobs, loving relationships and mental health.

I can't give an opinion regarding the advanced course. I didn't get that far.
I never really gave a thought to the people in the back of the room until one of the follow-up seminar evenings. I figured they were there to answer participant's questions and record the course leader's performance for review. Well, yes, and more. They DO watch participants and note their reactions. This became clear to me when a young man (a "reviewer") sat beside me during one of the "special evenings".

His attempt to get me engaged in the process of enrollment was clumsy and laughable. Obviously the Powers at LE were trying to salvage a sceptical, resistant worker bee (me). It was no coincidence that he chose to sit next to me. He was on a mission. This manipulation was, and is, repugnant! That was the last LE event I ever attended. Later that evening I got into an argument with my seminar leader about hard-sell tactics. I proved to be 'uncoachable".

Interesting possibility -- Legionnaire's Disease in a Landmark course room! Not that I'd wish that on the unsuspecting participants, but such an outbreak of disease would certainly give LE unwelcome publicity. You're absolutely right -- in such a closed environment, the "sharing" of bugs is just as likely as it would be in a commercial airliner.

As to whether or no you've "changed" -- I'd take your wife's opinion over that of an LE grad. The LE grad has an investment in "your having gotten it", especially if that grad is one of the "true believers". Your wife knows you best.

Congratulations on escaping relatively unscathed! Your own insights on your experiences, especially in the Advanced course, can serve as both information and warnings to others.